Modern Publicity Company, Erection of Advertising Pillars at Omnibus Stopping Places - Modern Publicity Company. 1932. Source: SMA (SMC), U1-3-3381 (0283-0311)

Referring to our letter of the 3rd instant (June 1932) in which we make application to erect illuminated bus stop indicators. The necessary drawings giving suggestions as the shape and form these should take were not then ready but we are now sending those and hope one of them will meet your approval.
Regarding the size of these indicators, we suggest the base should be 28" x 16" and the height a feet but should these dimensions be too large we are quite prepared to accept any suggestions you may make.

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A similar application was received in 1929 (vide Mintues of Traffic Committee dated 4/6/29) and for the reasons given in my report dated May 21, 1929, I am not in favour of granting the required permission.
It may be noted that the present proposed pillar has a base 28" x 16" as against 14 1/2" square base in the previous proposal.

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I am in agreement with the recommendation recorded by the Traffic Committee at their meeting June 4, 1929, when a similar application was before them for consideration and in consequence recommend that the present application be refused on the same grounds.

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I am directed to acknowledge receipt of your letters of June 3 and June 29 applying for permission to erect advertising posts in the form of illluminated bus stop indicators on the Council's footpaths in accordance with plans usbmitted.
In reply thereto, I am directed to inform you that similar proposals were considered by the Council in 1928 and 1929, when it was decided to refuse facilities on the grounds that the indicators would cause obstruction and increase the existing congestion on the footpaths. The applicants were informed that the Council was prepared to consider an application of the introduction of a pillar with a considerably smaller base, or alternatively, a device which could be fixed round existing street standards, but no proposals in this direction were received.
The drawings submitted by you show the base areas to be more than twice that which was disapproved by the Council in 1929, and I am accordingly directed to inform you that your application cannot be favourably entertained.

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With further reference to our letters of the Une 29th and August 12th and yours dated the 12th July relative to the above subject. In your reply to our application for a five year franchise to erect Bus Stop Indicators you intimated that the bases of the drawsings submitted to you were too large as they would cause a certain amount f congestion at points where space was most needed.
We are now submitting further drawings which do away with this objection and in the case of No.1 the projecting part of the inficator is 6'3" from ground level which will permit free and safe passage underneath. You will notice that this drawing shows for projections and some objection might be raised that one of these will over-hang the roadway but this can be avoided by placing the pillar in such a way that no obstrction will be caused to bus-drawing up to the curb.
Another suggestion is embodied in drawing No. 2 where three projections are shown and this will do away with the possible objection to drawing No. 1. Should you consider the height of the projection too low viz 4'3" we can easily raise it to 6' 3" as in drawing No.1. Drawing No.3 shows a simple form and has been included in case such a design should commend itself to you. All three designs can be flood lighted or otherwise as you may suggest.

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I adhere to my recommendation that the application to erect illuminated signs on footpaths should be refused.
The footpaths are already unduly obstructured by poles, etc, erected in connection with essential services, and I am strongly of the opinion that further encroachements for advertising pruposes should be disallowed. I return the drawings herewith.

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Anything that would tend to add to the existing congestion of the footpaths should be prohibited. I therefore recommend that this application be not approved. The drawings are returned herewith.

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Recommendation by the Acting Commissioner of Public Works and the Commissioner of Police that Mr. T. J. Evan's application to instal bus stop indicators be refused because of the added congestion they would cause.
Previous applications have been refused on the grounds that the indicators took up too much space on the pavement. The traffic Committe on June 4 1929 intimated that the Council would consider applications involving the use of smaller pillars. Mr .Evans proposes to use narrow pillars, one type having no projections less that 6 feet, 3 inches, above the ground. In view of the adverse departmental comments may this application also be refused?

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Renewed application by the Modern Publicity Company, for permision to instal illuminated bus stop indicatofs on the pavements, with adverse comment by the Acting Commissioner of Public Works and the Commissioner of Police. Previous applications have been refused on the grounds that the indicators would take up too much space on the pavements and aggravate congestion thereon.  The Traffic Committee one June 4, 1929, (vide attached file) intimated that the Council would consider applciations involving the use of smaller pillars. The present applicant proposes to use quite narrow pillars one type of which would have no projections less than 6ft., 3 inch. above the ground.
It appears that the Public Works Department and the Police consider that bus stop inficators of any type are unessential and should be prohibited and if members approve, a reply will be made accordingly.

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The opinion of the Bus Company might be asked, and Comments from Departments as to objection in outside districts.

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Referring to our letter of the 22nd ult with which we sent further drawings of bus stop indicators more in conformity ith your ideas, we would be much obliged if you will let us know if these drawings meet with your approval.

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With reference to the letter of September 22 from the Modern Publicity Company, relative to a proposal to erect bus stop indicators on Municipal Pavements, I have to request that you will kindly submit your further comment on the suggestion that "outside the Central District, where bus stops are less frequent, sign posts might serve a useful public service".
This suggestion is also being referred to the Acting Commissioner of Public Works, and at the same time the Omnibus Company is being invited to express its views on the subject.
 
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With reference to the letter of September 22 from the Modern Publicity Company, relative to a proposal to erect bus stop indicators on Municipal Pavements, I have to request that you will kindly submit your further comment on the suggestion that "outside the Central District, where bus stops are less frequent, sign posts might serve a useful public service".
This suggestion is also being referred to the Acting Commissioner of Police  and at the same time the Omnibus Company is being invited to express its views on the subject.

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You will recollect that in 1928 and 1929 the china General Omnibus Company Limited expressed itself in favour of the erection of Illuminated bus stop indicators on Municipal pavements. The Council, however, was unable to sanction the schemes then submitted on account of the obstruction to traffic which indicators would case.
An application has recetly been received from the Modern Publicity Company, 16 Jinkee Road, which proposes to sumont the difficulty by erecting slender pillars which would support the signs at some height above the ground. In one of their designs the pillar appears to be no more than 9 inches wide, except for a slight projection at the foot, while the signs would at no point be less than 6 feet, 3 inches, above the ground.
The Council is of opinion, however, that even these modified indicators are unsuitable for erection in the Central Districts, though in other parts, where bus stops are less frequent, the objection to their use would not be so great.
I am accordingly directed to enquire whether the Omnibus company desires bus stop indicators of a (p.2/2) suitable design to be installed in such localities as the Council might approve.

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In reply to your S/0 4784/2 of the 15th instant (October 1932), I am still definitely of the opinion that although illuminated bus stops might be of some slight convenience to the public, the disadvantages are so preponderant that the proposal should not receive the Council's approval. The undermentioned are some of the reasons that may be advanced in support of my recommendation.
1. To illuminated the pillars it would be necessary to lay cables in the footpaths and any further addtion to the congestion of cables, ducts, pipes, etc., under the roads is extremely undesirable. In addition, the footpath would require to be opened up whenever a bus stop was moved or repairs to the lighting system became necessary.
2. If the principal that illuminated advertisements on footpahts are permisible was once admitted, applications from other sources would be bound the eventuate. The Tramway Company, for instance, would feel entitled to erect similar stops for the trams (rail and raillers).
3. The positions of bus stops bear no relation to the width of the footpath and many of them prove to be quite unsuitable for the erection of a standard of the type suggested.
4. The proposed form of advertisement is naturally designed to attract attention and would be liable to cause further congestion on footpaths.
(p.2/2) (The Council has always adopted a strong attitude against footpaths obstructions, and the Deputy Secretary's letter No.1483 to the Secretary, French Municipal Administration, dated August 8, 1932, may be quoted; it will be noted that in this letter Municipal Notification No.4143 which limits projections over footpaths to a minimum height of 7'6" is referred to. I doubt whether vertical pillars without the addition of spaces on top for advertising matter would be regarded as having sufficient value as advertising media to justify the expenditure involved in their erection and maintenance and the above quoted regulation would apear to preclude any projection at a less height than 7'6".
With regard to the suggestion that these standards might be permitted on roads outside the Central District, I would remark that congestion on the Hongkew and Sinza Districts is equal to that in the Central District and if they were only permitted on outlying roads, the standards would lose much of their value to the public as indications of bus stops, as a certain amount of confusion would be inevitable.

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I am of opinion that the public roadways, wherever situated, should be kept clear of all advertising devices, and as the routes traversed by the Omnibus Company's vehicles are sufficiently well lighted to enable the public to located the present "stops" without difficulty, I do not see the need for illuminated sign stops.

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In reply to your letter No. 4782/2 of 15th inst. We beg to adivse that we have already taken steps to obtain plans of Bus-stop pillars similar to those in use in London.
As we consider these a very suitable type, we propose on recepti of the plans to submit same for your approval.

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The Council has in the past disapproved applications for permission to erect on the public footways of roads pillars which combined advertising matter with bus stop signs. For the existing bus stop signs, use is made, where possible, of lighting and other poles.
The Traffic Commission recorded that "uncesseary poles on footways should be avoided", and this view has been endorsed by the Police and Works Departments and has been upheld by the Council.  
In 1929, acting upon the recommendation of the Traffic Committee, the Council informed an applicant (Art Picture Advertising Co) for permission to introduce combined advertising-bus sign pillars throughout the public footways, that is was unwilling to accord permission for the type of pillar proposed, but that it was prepared to entertain a proposition for a pillar of smaller base. No further proposition eventuated.
The Modern Publicity Company has now submitted an applciation for a 5 year franchise to erect illuminated advertising-bus sign posts. The company state that it is not their intention to erect these posts in the congested streets but where the bus stops are less frequently used. The design of the post, they assert, is both aesthetic and utilitarian, and provides for a base occupying little space.
The Works and Police Departments are opposed to this application, expressing the respective views that "further encroachements for advertising pruposes should be disallowed" and that "anything that would tend to add to the existing congestion of the footpaths should be prohibited". Members generally have upheld these objections, but a member has enquired
(1) whether the Bus Company wants these posts and (
2) whether they might not serve a useful purpose in areas where bus stops are less frequent.
These enquiries are dealth with in the attached reports by the Works and Police Departments. A letter from the Bus Company is also attached from which it will be noted that the Company is obtaining plans of Bus-stop pillars similar to those in use in London.

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Illuminated Bus Stop Indicators - A renewed application by the Modern Publicity Company for permission to instal illuminated bus stop indicators which would also be sued for advertising purposes is submitted. In view of the adverse comments by the Police and Public Works  Departments on the ground that approval of this application would result in further obstruction of and congestion on the public footpaths, and having regard to the views expressed by the Traffic Committee that unncessary poles on footways should be avoided, members adhere to the decision recorded by circular that this application be not endorsed.

Replying to the question raised by Mr. Hughes as to whether these indicators might not serve a useful public purpose in the less congested areas, the Commissioner of Police states that in the opinion of the Traffic Department such areas are adequately served by the existing bus stop indicators.

In respect to the letter addressed to the China General Omnibus General Company, Limited, on October 15 enquiring whether it desires to instal bus sto indicators of a suitable design in such localities as the Council might approve and its reply to the effect that the Company has taken stops to obtain plans of Bus-top pillars similar to those in use in London which will be submitted to the Council for approval, members concur with the Chairman that the Council's letter may be interpreted by the Company as implying that permission will be accorded for the erection of such pillars whereas the intention of the letter was to elicit the Company's views as to the necessity thereof.

In view however of the definite departmental opposition to the erection of such pillars, members request that the Company be notified fothwith that approval for the erection of any type of bus stop indicator will not be forthcoming.

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I am directed to refer to the Council's letter of October 15 to your Company and to your reply thereto of October31, on the subject of Bus-top indicators.
Consideration having now being given to the application of the Modern Publicity Company, mentioned in the Council's letter, I am directed to inform you of the Council's disapproval thereof and to notify you of its unwillingness to sanction the erection of any type of Bus-stop indicator such as would occupy space on the public roadways of footways.

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I am directed to refer to your letter of September 22  and October 7, renewing your request for permission to erect advertising posts in the form of illuminated bus stop indicators on the Council's footpahts.
I am now directed to inform you that approval of your request is precluded by virtue of a recent decision of the Council that no bus stop indicators, of any type whatever, occupying space on the public footways or roadways will be permitted.

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We beg to acknowledge receipt of your letter 4784/2 of 2nd inst. Contents of which have been noted with thanks.

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Traffic Matters Before the Council - Avoidance of Unncessary Poles Upon Footpaths. Minutes of the Traffic Committee meeting of Noevember 25 (1932) were before the Council on December 7, when the recommendations of the Committe in regard to the following matters were endorsed. Illuminated Bus Stop Indicators.

A renewed application by the Modern Publicity Company for permission to instal illuminated bus stop indicators which would also be used for advertising purposes was submitted. In view of the adversed comments by the Police and Public Works Departments, on the ground that approval of this applciation would result in further obstrccution of and congestion on the public footpaths, and having regard to the view expressed by the Traffic Commission that unncessary poles on footways should be avoided, the Committee adhered to the decision recorded by circular that this application be not endorsed.

Replying to the question raised by a member as to whether these indicators might not serve a useful public purpose in the less congested districts, the Commissioner of Police stated that in the opinion of Traffic Department, such areas were adequately served by the existing bus stop indicators.